tv To Be Announced CNN October 18, 2013 12:00am-1:01am PDT
hour, similar to a small plane. >> the transition is kind of a symbol of what we can accomplish and that these things are totally technically achievable. >> pretty darn neat. thanks for watching. >> you don't like a particular policy, or a particular president, then argue for your position. go out there and win an election. push to change it but don't break it. >> so what is the say and who is in charge of the gop anyway?
i'll take that up with anthony weiner, ben ferguson and ralph and more fireworks later with star jones and edie hill and where is avonte. the search for the teen that disappeared from his school. avonte's mother joins me live. the big story, the reopening of the government. senator, welcome. are you exhausted? how are you feeling after all of this? >> i drove to west virginia today, piers, so i'm feeling very good right now. >> when you got back to west virginia, what are you saying to your constituents there, the people of west virginia, many of whom must be completely exasperated with what is happening in washington. how do you explain it? kind of pledges can you give going forward? >> first of all, they tell me how bad things look and what they have been seeing and they
all know me and i know them and i said if you think it's ugly from where you're setting, you ought to be sitting in my set and watching it happen. we're not used to this. in west virginia we don't do business this way. we try to identify our problem, bring people together, put our state ahead of our politics and work through it. that's what we always did when i was governor and we did it when i've been in legislature. it's always been about my state is first. this is about our country. why they are playing such high stakes poker, piers, is beyond me. this is self-inflicted by dysfunctional congress that's not putting this country or the people they represent. they believe in what they believe in. this isn't the place for it but the finances of our country. how much can we spend? can we get a budget together? can we get ourself out of debt? this is what we should be really working on.
>> let's play a clip from president obama today, him talking about settlement. >> today i want our people and our businesses and the rest of the world to know that the full faith and credit of the united states remains unquestioned. >> are the democrats completely blameless in this? is there another way to handle it that could avoid the shut down? is your view if you're being dispassionate about it? >> piers, the only thing i can tell you is without trying to find some accolades or whatever or some words that would describe it but when you jump into a pig pen, everybody comes out with a little stink on them. the bottom line is if anyone thinks they walked away from this or one side one-and-one side lost. we all lost. the american people lost. i think that it was -- a figure was given today of $24 billion,
the economy that we lost in our economy and it's lethargic to begin with. that's not coming back. when you think we did better than they did, we all performed so poorly we ought to be ashamed of ourselves. there is no need to have a shutdown of the government. i think they played it wrong. the democrats agreed to the number asked of 98 6 billion. that should be a reason and win to keep the government open. the debt ceiling, we should never get up to the eve of the debt ceiling and hold people in suspension and now thinking the full faith and credit, we'll never go in default nor she should we, especially
voluntarily and that's what i railed against. to say my goodness to think we might go down this again and there was 14 of us, seven democrats and seven republicans that said this is ridiculous, we need to stay together and that templet that you have no is the one that we worked on. it's the one that was voted on and says you will go back. the budget conference hasn't met for four years. start doing your job. see if you can unravel this. see if we can get back to some normal order of business -- >> here is the problem. >> if you will. >> you sound imminently reasonable and your actions endorse the fact you tried to get through this and ultimately have been successful as republicans you've been dealing with. mitch mcconnell was reasonable in what he said.
he said look, there will not be another shut down this is fine. you guys aren't the problem. the problem is senator ted cruz who has his gander up. he's got a popular vote now. he's massively more famous than he was two weeks ago. he's getting loads of money pouring in. he's the darling of the tea party and he today is saying let's not be too hasty because he thinks getting the shut down was good business for ted cruz incorporated. what will you do about this young renegade who doesn't really care about being reasonable? >> well, i know ted. i like ted. i get along fine with ted. i work and reach out to everybody, and i think that we can sit down and talk. we have to. you can't just discount one person or any group of people, but you can't govern from the fringes. you've seen us come together and come to the middle. you run your family, you run your own individual life, you run your businesses from the middle. not from the fringes of the right or the left.
with that being said, i think if we can sit and just, you know, really factor in on what we're dealing with which is a finance, let's get a budget. i've been a big supporter of the simpson plan that's been bipartisan since day one and grown in brand, if you will. it looks at reform. it looks at spending. it looks at revenue. and you've got to have confidence, the american people have to have confidence we have a fair tax system that we have a reform and waste and fraud and abuse in our intitlement programs, if you will and basically, our spending. absolutely. all this has to be looked at. >> what about unleashing your new -- what about unleashing your new attack dog, cory booker. putting him on ted cruz point man to point man. >> cory will be a welcome audition. we're eagerly awaiting his arrival the we can we come back and i think he'll be a really a great audition. he's been an executive. he's run a town.
he knows he has to work with both sides. he has a bottom line that he has to meet. he can't continue to put hardship on his people. there is a balance. all of us have come to the executive roles understand that. and we have an awful lot of good legislators with a lot on experience. now we got to use this for the betterment of our country. piers, we just cannot continue what you've just seen. this was the ugliest show on earth today that you saw unravel. the last week or two. that should never repeat it self-and the american political spectrum. >> a breath of fresh air talking to you, a voice of reason in a sea of insanity. thank you very much for joining me. >> thank you, piers. i've grew up in a state that's balanced. west virginia is a good place. come visit. >> i will do that. thank you very much indeed. >> thank you. joining me now is neat
gingrich, the host of cnn's host fire. i want to read that quote back, when you jump into a pig pen, everyone comes out with a little stink on them. we all lost. is that your take on the whole thing? >> oh, sure. look, i don't think anybody is a big winner out of this. the house republicans lost the fight they were in the middle of. the senate proved that it could only act at the last possible second. the president proved that he was incapable of bringing people together and getting anything done without a crisis. i don't think anybody comes out of this stronger or better of healthier and i don't sense the depth of rethinking that we need, you know, senator mansion is a great example. he's individually terrific. most of the senators are individually very smart and very experienced. most of the house members are very smart and very experienced. the president is very smart. yet, somehow we invented a system which reduces them
collectively to dramatically less than the sum of the individuals. there is really something wrong when you have an anti team as the model by which you try to run the country. >> let get to ted cruz because you've been right in the middle of a shutdown, we discussed this many times. he's clearly still a descenting voice, not necessarily there wouldn't be a shutdown or everybody going on course there won't be. we'll get to january and ted cruz may well try this again. how can he be stopped and how dangerous and how potentially powerful is he to a rival faction to moderate repub list m. >> i don't think he's dangerous unless the american people find his message accurate. you know, as we get beyond this week and people begin to realize the scale of the disaster of obama care, and they begin to realize the degree to which the websites don't work. there are now people coming out and saying they may never work. you may have to literally start over again.
as people, we realize prices are going to go up, not down. their choices of doctors will be limited, not wider. the country will demand change. if the president listens to the country, if the establishment listens to the country, ted cruz won't be very important but if they just run over the american people, he'll gain power every week because he'll express the frustration of the people. it's not ted cruz. it's the american people who are the source of the real power for this. >> can he be stopped, though? if we get to january and, you know, 95% of republicans totally agree it would be ridiculous to have another shutdown, could he still work the system to force one? >> when one or two or three members even in the senate can cause noise and they can cause nuisance but they can't cause a shutdown, i mean, this was a fight in which the house republican party, at least 90 or 95% of it was committed as a unit and you had one of the three constitutional parts of
how we make law engaged, this was not an act of a hand full of individuals and i think that that is very unlikely to happen again. steve king who is a congressman who is a -- conservative as ted cruz said to us on cross fire the other night, he did not think that could happen again in this congress as he put it. it takes an enormous amount of energy for a fight like that. my guess is they will mutt l through. you have to look at a much more fundamental question. we need to break out of this washington model. i mean, this is a system that isn't working in the bureaucracy and congress. it not working with the presidency and you are going to now see the budget committees come together for the first time in four years and we're expected to magically produce something by the 13th on december.
i don't quite know how that will happen because all the habits of the city right now are exactly backwards, and they are more likely to lead to gridlock than solutions. >> let's end this on a happy note. i want to show you a live shot of the panda cam. you were distraught it was not in business. there is a live video of the panda cam. they are alive and well and we can see them in their natural habitat. give me your reaction to this news. >> it's wonderful. my granddaughter has a baby panda she carries around which she calls creatively panda. it's a wonderful reminder that there is life beyond politics and there is life beyond the mess washington is and i hope every visitor that comes here, will find time to visit the national zoo as well as mount vernon. they will get history and natural history in one visit. >> newt gingrich, well said. nice to speak to you again.
what's next for republicans and the nation? live with anthony weiner, ben ferguson. a trio of real power panelists.i e diet? this is the creamy chicken corn chowder. i mean, look at it. so indulgent. did i tell you i am on the... [ both ] chicken pot pie diet! me too! [ male announcer ] so indulgent, you'll never believe they're light. 100-calorie progresso light soups. you'll never believe they're light.
there are no winners here. these last few weeks have inflicted completely unnecessary damage on our economy. we don't know yet the full scope of the damage, but every analyst out will believes it slowed our growth. >> president obama today on the real loser in shut down showdown. on capitol hill both parties bracing for the backlash. joining me now ben ferguson, anthony weiner. anthony weiner, welcome back. >> thank you. >> how the devil are you? >> nice to be here. >> you were boasting to me in the break you were a congressman for 12 years and there was no government shut down. >> i was the glue that held the place together, more or less.
>> why did it come to this and why did we avoid it happening again in january? >> unfortunately, i don't see a dynamic it changes that much. two groups of republicans, the tea party fateful who thought this was fine and boasting now they made progress and those concerned about ply marries and as soon as this -- until there is a sense of what they are for and not against there is a large number, important number of republicans stopping things from happening is important parative so they had a rough couple weeks. >> you have a problem with this. you don't like the way republicans behaved. explain that. >> well, i mean, i think that you can see in the end game pretty much what most observers
conservative and liberal predicted from the beginning, republicans went with goals and no strategy to achieve them and the government was shut down for three weeks and the approval ratings went down and the democrats made no concessions and the republicans gave up. and it pretty hard to imagine any scenario in which it wouldn't have played out this way and frankly, i think what you've heard in the aftermath from house republicans is a fair amount of justifiable embarrassment how this played out and to former congressman weiner's point, i'm skeptical that anything like this specifically is going to happen again in the next year or so. you had speaker gingrich on talking about steve king saying we're not going to get up for this fight again. i think that in general, i would expect this sort of internal republican politics to play
themselves out maybe in primary campaigns but maybe not so much in a push for a shut down in washington. >> ben ferguson, you're shaking your head in furry, as usual, why? >> i mean, there is two things here that make me laugh. one, congressman weiner's comments the republicans don't know what they are for. anthony, i know you've been on vacation but are you kidding me? it about defunding obama care. that's what they are in favor of. that the what the tea party got elected to do. surely, out of the whole government shutdown, you and others understand exactly what it is that the tea party and conservatives were in favor of. and the second issue here was this, to imply somehow this had no positive at all for at least moving the idea that obama care is not working forward, i think would be naive. people are not talking about it, and i would say to the mitch mcconnells and the moderates out there that john boehners that are trying to act like somehow this was beneath them, they had a total history of failure over
the last five years against the obama administration. this is the first fight that even was descent by republicans and conservatives. so i don't think this was some horrible failed day for them. i think they said we're tired of losing all the time with john mccain leading so the younger guys -- >> with respect -- >> they -- >> with respect, ben, they lost again and cost the american economy $24 billion. quite a high price to pay. quite a high price to pay. talk about obama care when they could have been talking act it anyway without shutting down the government. anthony weiner, ben ferguson laid down the challenge to you. talking complete nonsense, what do you want to say? >> he actually made my point. you can't say we're in favor of undoing something someone else did. it's hard to discern a difference from campaign 2012. what i referred to is simply saying we're against something and voting 46 times to defund it or stop it or end it doesn't
count in my book to being for something in washington. if you're for affordability and availability of health care, that's something you try to navigate the differences. i don't think the scaffolding of a party can't just be i'm against anything obama does. i don't think that resinating with the american people. >> when you were there for 12 years -- when you were there for 12 years, anthony, could you sit down with republicans and have a dialogue and conversation with them and when bush was in office you actually had democrats that could go to the white house and have a conversation. the other issue here is the president of the quite of america never passed a budget that's a massive problem and he
refuses to negotiate on anything and you can't -- hold on, you can't say that's the republicans fault because he had the house and the senate all to himself for two years and you guys still, when you were there, never passed a budget. that the kind of embarrassing, if you ask me. [ overlapping speakers ] >> let me jump in. let me jump in. >> ross, hold your anger. i can see you're agitated. we got to take a short break. when we come back, the floor will be yours, ross, followed by anthony weiner. this will be a process i'm going to go to after the break. my fiery guess, anthony
my fiery guess, anthony weiner, ross, and ben ferguson. >> i've calmed myself. i'm very relaxed. i'm going to be a peacemaker. >> rip ben into pieces. >> i'll agree with both ben and anthony. i think anthony is absolutely right the shutdown is a debacle for republicans and right now it's possible that just being against obama care ideally
without the anchor of a government shut down dragging them down might be a compelling message for republicans because it's remarkable and i think people will start to recognize it a bit more now that we're not talking about washington politics, just how completely the obama white house seems to have botched the general rollout of the most i'm prior tablet program but what allows people to buy health insurance. democrats know it's a serious problem and this is why if it continues to be a problem, we probably won't be talking about the shut down in three months time. >> right, anthony weiner, let talk about 2016, you have good connections with hillary clinton and she is expected to run, not sure what the gop is and when you look at the runners and riders here, who do you think the democrats should fear most, is it chris christie or actually, potentially someone like ted cruz?
>> i see no reason why this dynamic won't play out in the primary complex. ted cruz lost this first primary. republicans, he basically put them in a corner and i look at the numbers in the republican party and within the favorites that choose people in iowa and he's doing great. so this kind of -- look, i think the republican party and i'm not the first to say this is in the mist of this identity crisis that i thought ended in 2012 and it clearly didn't. to some degree, i would be very -- i'm an institutional republican and i know we have to fix immigration and have our enideas and we can't say no to all forms of revenues no matter where they are. i'm concerned that my party is going to be stuck doing this same dance for awhile now. i mean i'm -- >> i'm glad you're not a republican. >> they clearly take their advice from me -- >> i don't think so.
[ laughter ] >> ben ferguson, though, ben ferguson, let me ask you this, the big question is going to be is this kind of civil war rumbles on in the republican party is which way will you go. we've been down this road before with sarah palin, the queen of the tea party, not the brightest in the tool box and now you got ted cruz the king of the tea party according to allen one of the brightest students he had at harvard. could be a different kettle on fish when it comes to fighting election. >> yeah. >> could he win an election for the republicans and if so, does he deserve more support than perhaps he's getting right now? >> i think if you look at ted cruz and what he's good at, he's a brilliant mind. he's an incredible debater. he would beat them and trump them on those levels, and so i think he's got a very good shot in 2016 but when you look at the republican party right now as anthony described it, there is
one thing i agree. the john mccains of the republican party are done. there will be the has beens. they are over it and holding on for dear life. they are still guys with ideas and they are not and i think ted cruz is proof of that. mitch mcconnell and john mccain, those years, i hope they enjoyed it because they are not going to be leading this party for the next ten years, so there is a fight right now for the new leadership but i don't think it's a bad thing. i actually think it's a positive thing because when the other guys have been in charge, we're getting our brains beat in. every single election and they haven't done very well -- >> yeah, okay, let me go to ross on this because i mean, that is a fair point. i watched ted cruz in action and you see a smart guy, very passionate, very good speaker, good debater. if i was a democrat up against him, i would be pretty concerned actually -- >> would you, actually, though, piers -- >> i think i would be concerned he could galvanize people.
>> i think ted cruz is absolutely galvanize people and if you look -- there is a poll released of republicans and there was 74% approval rate. his approval ratings with the rest of the party were pretty terrible and his approval rating for the country as a whole are approaching pretty ugly territory for someone on the national stage for a year. if you look at cruz his strategy is becoming the standard bear for the tea party and winning the iowa caucuses and sort of basically clearing the field to take on chris christie. i think that's the dynamic you're looking at in 2016. if crews can clear out early, get rid of a ran paul, get rid of rubio, scott walker and sort of take on christi, head-to-head, he has a chance. >> i'm curious, is there no lesson learned from 2012 of the republican party --
>> we did learn. >> if the lesson -- >> anthony -- >> let me finish -- >> 2012 -- let me say this, 2012 we learned mitt room know is a terrible candidate and so was john mccain. >> the difficulty -- in spite of all the problems with mitt romney, he actually ran ahead of a lot of consecutive republican senate candidates in senate races. so it's not to say the problem was mitt romney. there was a party wide problem. it requires sin thinks, a civil war and the winner to reunite the party because you can't have a party without a base. you can't have a party without moderates. who can do that? >> i have to wrap it up there. a great debate. thank you-all very much. >> thanks. the frantic search for an autistic teenager in new york. police scouring the city looking for the boy. his mother joins me live coming up next. the despite search for a
first here is don. >> reporter: inch by inch, street corner by street corner, seemingly everyone in new york city locking for 14-year-old avonte. >> it mom, come to the flashing light. >> reporter: in queens near the school where he was seen search vans broadcast his mother's voice in hopes he would recognize it and come to him. >> how did you come up with that message? >> that is something that i tell him when he comes home from school. i always say hi, avonte. because i want him to give the response, hi mom so sometimes he tells me hi mom. >> reporter: this surveillance video, the last anyone seen of avonte, he can't communicate verbally and after approaching a security guard that didn't allow him to exit the school. avonte found an unmonitored side door and vanished. >> he's not supposed to be
running through the halls without supervision. he's not supposed to be walk out the door and you're not stopping him. >> reporter: new york city police commissioner ray kelly does not believe the security quad is at fault. >> we see him on film and statements by the security agent and other people that we believe that it wasn't any wrongdoing on her part. >> reporter: a source close to the investigation tells cnn searches are concentrating on a five-block area around the school with particular focus on a marshy landfill cameras don't show the child going into the neighborhood so he may have headed toward the water. avonte's father believes he's elsewhere. >> i look at it part of their job to do that but i'm pretty sure he's not there. he didn't like -- he didn't have any feeling towards water, large bodies of water. he wasn't about that. >> reporter: water, an ominous fear, they are keeping positive
trying to find one young boy among millions. one family with an entire city behind them. joining me now is avonte's mother and the family attorney. welcome to you both. >> thank you. >> it's every parents' night mare and desperate to get your son back. do you believe in your heart that he's still alive? >> yes, i do. >> what do you think has happened to him? do you feel in your gut? >> i feel that someone has him, are holding him because there is not a surveillance tape around that shows him at all in a train station, not walking in the street, anywhere. >> he loved the subway and so that's why you've been recording these messages for the subway. if he was down there with all the attention it's now received, do you believe he would have been discovered now?
is that why you feel he was taken against his will? >> yes. >> let's listen again to the message. this is the message you can hear on the subway in new york in relation to avonte. >> hi, avonte, it mom. come to the flashing lights avonte. hi, avonte, it's mom. come to the flashing lights avonte. >> do you believe, vanessa, that the school was negligent? >> yes. >> they should never have let him out of the school? i should have been impossible? >> yes. >> i suppose the other side of that argument is he's 14 years old, although he has a mind more of a seven or eight-year-old. he's 14. he's a tall boy. he may have given security the slip. he was fairly quite bright. do you think that could have happened? >> even though he's 14, it shouldn't matter. no one should be, you know, allowed to runaround the hallways in school and that security guard should have questioned him, and if he didn't
answer, she should have got up from her seat and said come here and called someone because at that time he wasn't supposed to be out of the school. >> david, what is your view of the legal position of the school? it's obviously complicated because we're trying to integrate avonte in the main stream of the school and this happened, which is a disaster. >> before i do anything else, there is a lot of talk about that and i'll answer that. i wanted to thank the police department and the community and members of the press getting his name and picture out there. the efforts are unprecedented and -- >> and social media is extraordinary. everyone tweeting about it and trying to find him. >> it incredible. as far as legal aspects of it, there is a bunch of things. there is a big picture and the big picture is i don't understand how this happens to a special needs child unless there is something in there that failed the family.
on a more detailed basis and understand we're only dealing with limited information because they don't tell us everything up front. >> right. >> he got off a line where he was being transitioned from class, apparently. so somebody must have not been watching. they know from his iep programs that he runs and he runs off during transitioning, so they are aware of it. so he gets away. he gets down stairs. he's confronted apparently by a security guard. he gets past that, as you said, gives them the slip, goes down the hall, goes out a door that is not alarmed that is now alarmed and this is the worst part of it all. it took the police -- not the police, it took the board of education, the school officials a full 45 minutes at a bare minimum to call the police and that time period -- >> crucial, absolutely crucial. >> vanessa, if by any chance he's able to watch this interview either now or when it's replayed perhaps tomorrow or somebody whose holding him as you believe is watching it, what would your message be first to avonte and then to who may be holding him.
>> my message to my son is i love hip and we're going to find him. you'll come home to your family. and for anyone who has him, please be kind and to let him go. bring him, you know, to somewhere, i don't care if it's a fast food restaurant, a fire department, police station, just, you know, drop him there, you know. >> i want to give final details to anyone watching who may be able to help. a gray striped shirt with black jeans and black sneakers. he's 5'3" with 120 pounds. if you have information call 1800-577-tips or text 274637 crimes and enter tip 577. i pray that your boy comes back to you. >> thanks. >> thanks again. coming up, the most powerful man in washington, when it comes to compromise they blew it. star jones and e.d. hill weigh
women led the way to reopening the government, no temper tantrums and begs the question are women better negotiators than men? i'll talk about that with star jones, attorney and spokes person for the professional women and e.d. hill, author of "i'm not your friend, i'm your parent." tough. >> sounds like my mother, actually. >> star jones, would we be better to kick the men out of the room in washington and let the women thrash it out or is this a terrible cliche that when actually push comes to shove wouldn't make a difference? >> it did make a difference. it's interesting of the 13 senators that put the bipartisan together half were indeed women, when women only comprise 20% of the senate. we have 20 seats out of 100. it's clear the women took the lead in the situation and i would tell you, in these, i try to learn in life.
if you don't get on the stick. i thought that was admirable, courageous leadership is what the women showed. >> amy hill, i think you would disagree with that. >> no. i think you're totally sexist. i think it's ridiculous this day and age to be sitting there saying a woman just because she's a woman or a man just because he's a man can do anything better. if you look at the people who have also been cited as the obstructionists in congress, those happen to be some women, too. so i think you find good people and you find bad people everywhere you go. it has nothing to do with -- >> these men had the opportunity to step up. these women chose to step up. showing negotiating skills. >> other women were being as obstructive as the obstructive men. some of them were. >> not on the leadership side. that's the point.
we don't have as many women on the leadership side that could step into that point. >> is that a good point? if there were more women actually running the show, because there really aren't, if there were would that help in the final negotiation stage of these processes? >> i think nancy pelosi is pretty senior. i think michele bachmann's got a pretty strong voice. if you're a person who feels that there are people in there that were sort of gumming up the works, i would say that on both sides you could point to those two women. maybe you support them, maybe you don't. they certainly were taking the more strident positions. you definitely have great women in there. but i think they're great human beings. they're great americans. >> i think they're great human beings, but we also have to agree if the women had not stepped up we would not be in this position. we can go back and forth you want that the guys are just as good as the women and we
negotiate same way. i do think that i disagree with that. i see it across the board all the time when it comes to women. i do every day sit with powerful women. that's my job. >> and are women instinctively do you think less testosterone fueled? >> no question. >> this ted cruz alpha male chest beating i must win at all costs. >> that's because we don't encarriage in that time-honored sport of whose is bigger. that's not a big deal to me. >> a kid on the opposing football team hits my son i am ready to go bust his butt because it makes me that mad. i don't think women are any weaker mouthed or anything. do we have more common sense? yes. i think that is simply because the fact of the matter is for a long time we have been run the houses, running the budget, doing those things. >> women have to be more practical. i do have the lion's share of the practicality of the household. >> you have to be pragmatic, have new york skills, willing to compromise. you have to walk into the room with the attitude of how do i make this work rather than this won't work. i think we do that better. >> we also have to deal with the kids. you've got to discipline. you've got to be the firm one.
you've got to be the one who's the peacemaker fighting siblings. do i think there are unique qualities that women by nature do possess because of -- >> did you see that? we can disagree without being disagreeable. >> quite fascinating. if two men had started the way this discussion started with you leaping up and saying that's sexist it would have very quickly become a chest beating argument where they would both be determined to win. you've actually reached an interesting point of consensus which in itself is quite illuminating. let's come back. i want to talk about the 2016 race because there may very well be at the end of all that the first female president of the united states. then we'll really find out won't we if you're better at this game than we are? >> we sure can't be worse. ñn
16 days the world watched washington have a temper tantrum then the grownups stepped in to safety day, most of them women. i'm back now with star jones and e.d. hill. a little discussion in the break there quite interesting. you both have a texan connection. you studied law there, you come from there. what do you make of ted cruz down in texas? >> i don't think kay bailey hutchison knew what was coming down the pike. that's for sure. she'd still be sitting in that seat if she had. i think that ted cruz is in it for ted cruz. there are plenty of people who think that's the right direction
to take the country. the way i look at folks, i have supported people i disagreed with and i did agree with. but i like to know where you stand. i think that's where a lot of texans can come from. you may tell me something. i may say you're full of it, you're brilliant. whatever it is. as long as i really believe that's what you think. like ron paul. >> do you not believe it ted cruz is sincere then? >> i think that ted cruz is very focused on ted cruz. >> right. ted cruz is all about ted cruz right now. what he's doing -- >> what are most politicians really about? 99%. >> you call them politicians, i would refer them to be elected officials. >> right. >> they forget that you're supposed to have the dual brain. if you're going to lead then you have to govern. and ted cruz is not about governing right now. he's about getting in the leadership position so he can set himself up for 2016. it may be fine for him and the
people who like him but not the country. the point about ted cruz is, he's made obama care his great bet he's going to go after. his instincts might be right that obama care is potentially a disaster for the democrats and the president. the system simply didn't seem to work very well. >> i agree with him on that. >> throughout this nonsense of the last two weeks have hit on the great vulnerability. >> i am not saying that he is wrong on a lot of these issues. it's the way that he's gone about doing it they disagree with. however, that said, i know a lot of people in texas who absolutely love him, who feel that he is the strong champion, the man of principles that they don't find in washington. they find him -- they find him to be somebody who's very fresh. >> don't you also see that that is the extreme position right now? we were talking in the break about how the country is moving to the middle. >> right. >> you can't be extreme on the right or extreme on the left because you can't find compromise in those two position. and a ted cruz, though he may stand in his own moral space,
that's not the morality of the country. >> it may not be. >> it doesn't benefit the united states of america. >> i have to leave it there. fascinating debate. thank you very much, star jones and e.d. hill. that's it for us tonight. what are you promising this morning? >> the world. i will give you the world. >> the government is at least back for work but for how long, bermm berman? what do officials need to do to avoid another shutdown. >> edward snowden has broke his secre secrecy. why he thinks he has helped for leaking the nsa documents and guess what he says he has in his possession now? for anyone who has him, please be kind and let him go. >> if you haven't seen th